School of Caring Domination [ return ]
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Cynthia
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3/02/2003
16:39:09
Subject: Two Dishwashers
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Message:
Dear William,

I do not want to be ignoring your letter. You spoke of two dishwashers. One just washed the dishes. That man we perceive as having no needs, no one controlling him, no one that he controls. That means he has no friends, and no relationships. The other was being submissive. In your story this man is distressed, but that's just because you told the story. My story.

One submissive washes the dishes because his dominating wife told him to. This fulfills his need for control. When he is done, his wife is pleased with him. They are both happy.

Another submissive washes the dishes because it is his job. After his wife goes to bed, he goes to the internet and finds a dominatrix promising to humiliate him. He pays money, masturbates, and goes to bed. His wife wonders why he has lost interest in sex.

Cynthia


William
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3/03/2003
15:53:49
RE: Two Dishwashers
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Cynthia:

You understand the problem excellently. Your submissive man goes on the internet precisely because his craving for submission is never fulfilled. He is like a hungry being with a very big stomach and a tiny little mouth. He can never fulfill his appetite. Not even by his acts of submission and his partner's praise can help him. Free the man from the craving!

The man who washes the dishes and understands it thus can and probably does have lots of friends and loving relationships. He can because he is free and has the space in this life that enables this to happen.

The problem, you see, is the psychological bondage of domination and submission. It is not a basis for a relationship. It confines the spirit and kills the opportunity of being human in this world, here and now.


Cynthia
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3/04/2003
01:26:10
RE: Two Dishwashers
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Yes, I think the submissive needs submission or control, or something like that. Maybe he just wants the perfect relationship, someone he would die for and someone that deserves that submission. And like the need for food, I don't think that need goes away. But he can fulfill that appetite, with caring domination from his wife. And when it is used right, it can be a wonderfully positive force in a relationship.

Don't you want a wife who wants to please you? Don't you want to love her so much that you want to please her and would risk your life for her? Don't you want a wife so wise and kind that if she told you to do something, you could just do it knowing that she loved you and cared for you?

Again, I feel like we agree but seem to be arguing. I read some of the BDSM literature and stories. I usually cannot stand it. Dominant wives speaking of their husbands with no love or respect. Submissives seeking complete destruction of their pride, strength, and self-esteem. Dominant men trying to psychological enslave their female submissives.

If you want to fight this, you have my best wishes. But you have stumbled on a website that tries to avoid this. I want to create knights, I want happy loving relationships, I want submissives being happy and good productive citizens.

Cynthia




William
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3/04/2003
10:38:24
RE: Two Dishwashers
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Cynthia:

I will only respond here and not under the thread about "kinks" where you have also written. My response would be much the same.

You might be in a position to see the same danger in your "caring domination" as you apparently see in the "domination" you critique. I say this because you have twice now referred to this dialogue as a argument or a fight, suggesting that I am fighting with you. In fact this tells us that you are actually fighting with yourself. You feel something needs to change. I have hit upon a open spot in your heart and it has awakened your mind. It is as though you remember something, forgotten long ago. You want to understand what it is I am saying, but it is difficult to see and it appears to mean giving something up. You want to see and understand a different goal that leads to the fruit of 'friendliness, compassion, sympathetic joy and equanimity.'

Your questions, above, are impossible to answer in this forum. The underlying premise confuses unhappiness with happiness.

Domination has truth value for you. You have invested in it and your investment depends upon the submission of others. Otherwise, you can not fulfill your own craving, clinging and desire. This craving is not at all like the need for food, which sustains life. This craving sustains only itself and its fruit is unhappiness. To see this one needs to walk all the way through the steps that lead from cause to effect, from craving domination to your unhappiness. You have not yet done so. One day perhaps, with guidance, you will do it for yourself and then share the fruit with others.

Feel for your pulse rate now. Your heart is beating fastly. Let it do so for a while and when you no longer feel angry with me think about your life. Think about love. Think about a basis for love in friendliness, compassion, sympathetic joy and equanimity. There are conditions which bring this about and there are conditions which destroy this as a possibility. You can see the difference between the two sets of conditions. Your are clearly intelligent enough, but you are afraid. That is understandable. Try to remember.






DanW
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7/07/2003
09:26:53
RE: Two Dishwashers
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Clearly the response of a man too heavily "invested" himself in a barren and stingy form of relating to appreciate the beauty of generosity and devotion.


DanW
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7/07/2003
09:29:14
RE: Two Dishwashers
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Clearly the response of a man too heavily "invested" himself in a barren and stingy form of relating to appreciate the beauty of generosity and devotion.


Lev Bronstine
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9/27/2003
07:02:17
RE: Two Dishwashers
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Hey I think your site is wonderful. I think your intentions are honorable. I think this is exactly what the whole BDSM community needs. I wish your site was better known. You need more stuff on it.

I don't see what this guy is arguing about. You seem to be saying the same thing; except that he apprently thinks that all forms of D/s are bad, even most caring.

I think your intentions are great, and you have a good heart.


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